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Talk:CBS-742 Ptolemaios 2 Kai
Need help with image & translation Can someone photoshop and clean-up Ptolemy Kai's image on this latest image? Also, anyone know about what the articles says? Thanks for your efforts. Wasabi 22:16, July 24, 2010 (UTC) :From what I read on mechatalk forums, it appears those strip like things on the tail are boosters of some kind. :~ Azkaiel 22:53, July 24, 2010 (UTC) :The added units on the rear are indeed boosters as labeled in the image. Also, it would appear (at least from what is visible in the available images) that the Ptolemaios 2 Kai has had all of its missile launchers removed. Close examination of the line art will reveal that all launchers (above and below the engines, forward of the GN turrets, and on the lower pod just aft of the torpedo launchers) are no longer depicted. Arvis1804 16:34, July 30, 2010 (UTC) GNS-74 Dav7d2 (sp), are you sure that the correct ship number is GNS-74. I mean it sounds valid but where did you obtain this information?Gaeaman788 12:56, October 12, 2010 (UTC) Oh no sorry, it was a late night and I mistyped the model number, I went back and fixed it to its proper model number, Sorry! Dav7d2 19:15, October 12, 2010 (UTC) Need Specs Guys, did anyone online posted up info about the specs of the Ptolemy? It was said the ship went through some weapons and systems upgrades, but nothing much was covered. Was the novel, movie, or publication released with anything than vague details? Taikage - the greatest evil since whole wheat bread 20:59, October 12, 2010 (UTC) Need Snapshots & Specs Guys: Did anyone notice anything really different about Ptolemy II Kai or it's just fitted with a GN Booster and that's it? Anyway, please someone take good snap shots of the ship and load them up for the page. Thank you. Taikage - cracking down on fantasy gundam bloggers 06:06, January 6, 2011 (UTC) The most defining characteristic of the Ptolemy II Kai is the boosters. In the movie they detach the boosters while in Trans-Am, which makes Ptolemy II Kai turn back into Ptolemy II. So the boosters are the only real chage to the ship. Which now brings into question of calling it Ptolemy II Kai if all you have to do is strap on two GN Boosters. This also leads me to question why this page is even here. This is the equivalent of HaroSan's stupid 00 Raiser+GN Sword III page, or making a separate page for the Zabanya with the extra holster bits Gaeaman 788 - pilot of the RB-79/FS Ball Full Saber 02:06, January 6, 2011 (EST) Big question-Keep or merge w/ Ptolemy 2 Since MAHQ updated their 00 Movie stuff, it lists the Ptolemy II Kai as being just the Ptolemy II, with two boosters. MY question to you all is if this page should be merged with the Ptolemy II page or left as is. I say this because the Ptolemy II Kai is the Ptolemy II just with two boosters attached to the engines. We haven't seen any upgrades in armament, the model number is the same, and there's no change in design between P2 and P2Kai. So we need a vote on whether or not this page should be kept or mergedGaeaman 788 - pilot of the RB-79/FS Ball Full Saber 10:04, January 8, 2011 (UTC) I think we should wait till we get more technical data and background info on it, just to be sure. -Dav7d2 - The ChroniK Editor! 10:14, January 8, 2011 (UTC) Guys: I think we should be damn proud of ourselves at the fact that our sources on 00 Gundam has long surpassed MAHQ. I also think it's the first time they got their pages filled with a host of errors and missing various data. The funny thing is, I don't think they bothered to check out our stuff as a resource. Any case, I put some serious work into these pages, but I'm not against merging the pages either. A extra pair of GN Boosters doesn't warrant another new page. However, all the magazines and stuff talked how they had all these new features added in and it was a serious let-down that I didn't see much of anything new. I also believe patience is prudent. Once the official publishing of the guide book finally comes out, we'll see all that we need to see and know everything. When is that coming out anyway? You think it would be out by now before anyone loses interest. Taikage - cracking down on fantasy gundam bloggers 11:02, January 8, 2011 (UTC) At the moment I'd have to agree with Taikage about this page. As said we should await the release of 00 Final Mechanics which will no doubt lay out exactly how the Ptolemy II Kai differs from the Ptolemy II. Whilst the GN boosters are the only outside change I'd like to believe that somewhere inside there's a few differences - I mean the Ptolemy II did take a beating during "Setsuna" so I'm sure they might have upgraded just a little - of course that's just my personal opinion. As far as I Know Taikage, 00 Final Mechanics isn't out until early spring this year but I'm unsure if there's any other guide/reference books out just now. - Strike Albion 11:19, January 8, 2011 (UTC SA, you're talking about Rebirth, the final episode of Season 2. Alright, since the votes are 0-3, for right now we keep the page as is. I've heard good reasons from SA and Taikage to wait until 00 Final Mechanics ''comes out, despite us not knowing wht these "new features" are that have been added to Ptolemy II besides the GN Boosters. Depending on what ''Final Mechanics ''says when it comes out, we migh revote on this in the Spring.Gaeaman 788 - pilot of the RB-79/FS Ball Full Saber 18:30, January 8, 2011 (UTC) Although, the ship is only referred to as CBS-74 Ptolemaios 2, it was never stated in the movie to be the CBS-74 Ptolemaios 2 KaiGaeaman 788 - pilot of the RB-79/FS Ball Full Saber 20:53, January 10, 2011 (UTC) Ah yeah I did mean 'Rebirth 'thanks. To be fair I'd tend to go with officially produced lineart/notes over the fan subbed - even if the subs are correct. Offical lineart/notes tops fan subs in my opinion. - Strike Albion 23:46, January 10, 2011 (UTC) I take it the reverse. Anything from the anime (subbed) is a priority since its what is visually seen by the viewers. The notes and documents are left to filling the blanks that the anime didn't explain. Though I did notice a kanji character after the "2" in Ptolemaios 2, which I think was "Kai" but I was watching the subs and they would have indicated the "kai" character I believe. Since the boosters are detachable could they be counted as optional equipments or a special feature of the P2Kai. If any other subs of the movie come out and reference the "Kai" then it is Ptolemy 2 Kai. Otherwise I see it as a extension of Ptolemy 2 - I would like to point out something, the Gaplant Kai trivia section states the "Kai" just mean modified in english. This websites definition on "modified" states it as "to change or alter; esp., to change slightly or partially in character, form, etc.". Meaning the modification on the Ptolemaios 2 could just be a slight change, suggesting toward the boosters. Once again, I am just pointing this out, I still think we should wait for the ''00 Final Mechanics. -Dav7d2 - The ChroniK Editor! 02:53, January 29, 2011 (UTC) Seeing is believing? Am I the only one who can't see the page? its just one massive blank article that I'm getting. -Dav7d2 - I like edit naked when no one is around! >;D 02:47, May 18, 2011 (UTC) :Looks normal to me. -SuperSonicSP 08:09, May 18, 2011 (UTC) Tau Drive Line "With budget and time constraints under consideration, CB engineers decided to adapt GN T Drives and enhanced GN Condensers to supplement their pre-existing MS force." This line troubles me a bit, not because of fact that Ptolemaios Kai can support Tau Drives, we know it could because of Raphael but rather because of the implication it gives about CB uses Tau Drives. To my knowledge, the Ptolemaios Faction itself does not use any and Tieria works on his own rather than consults things with the Ptolemaios engineers (Fon has his own little faction as well with his own devil logo, his own Veda and his own Tau suits, rather than being part of the main faction). The only example I can think off would be the GRM from 00I 2314, which I "think" might use a Tau Drive (not too knowledgeable on the 00I 2314 GRM), but even then its because they collected it and its only Drive from the Innovators. Other than that, I don't recall the main CB faction adopting such a new wide policy, because if they did they would be using more Tau Drives on their older suits rather than relying on so many Condenser suits like Astraea F2, the repaired Cherudim SAGA, the repaired Arios Ascalon, Exia Repair III, and Dynames Repair. There's also some speculative lines regarding it having its own Tau Drives on the bottom. I don't think there's any basis for that to be there at all given that the Ptolemaios Faction hasn't really seen adopting any Tau Drive policy or making any of their own, nevermind the fact that the ship spurts out green particles and pink beams. -SuperSonicSP 04:03, September 3, 2011 (UTC) :I haven't read that Celestial Being used GN Tau Drive. With their GN Condenser having almost the same power(?, correct me about the appropriate term here) as the GN Drives (as shown in 00 Raiser Condenser), there's no way they will resort to GN Tau Drive. --Bronx01 (talk| ) 13:30, September 3, 2011 (UTC) I disagree that they have the same average performance though, they seem far lmore inferior to Tau Drives to me on the operation time aspect. 0 Gundam ACD burned through its condenser fairly quickly and it wasn't even flying. The GN Archer was also shown to require frequent recharging from Arios just to operate. The 00 Raiser Condenser Type I would consider to be one of the exceptions but that's mostly because of the Twin Condenser System that it's implied to have (implied from 00V Senki Mission 10 and the UI seen in the movie). Even then the 00 Raiser likely has the operation time of any other average Large Condenser suit anyways; just functioning at the far higher Twin Drive power level. The 00 Gundam without the system with two Large Condensers can barely Trans-Am for 0.03 seconds. -SuperSonicSP 06:20, September 5, 2011 (UTC) :That would be the case if you're talking about 2 years ago. But during their 2 years prior to 2314, CB has been trying to improve this technology, said in the 00V. The movie showed that 00 Gundam could pull more than 0.03 seconds of Trans-Am, implying that they managed to improve very much (If they're still that much useless, I expect that Trans-AM Burst isn't even possible beyond 0.03 seconds, or much further than a minute.) --Bronx01 (talk| ) 12:12, September 5, 2011 (UTC) I wrote that piece so I should at least add in something into this conversation. I changed it to "adapt GN T Drive technology" to avoid the suggestion that CB is applying actual GN T Drives (though that would've resolved a bunch of particle shortage issues, including Ptolemy II Kai itself), only some of its tech was applied (even though all of it would've been applicable). As for enhanced condensers, I mentioned that based on available literature (00V). If there are any further issues, please tell me. Taikage - Admin 12:27, September 5, 2011 (UTC) I'm pretty sure that in the movie, one of the Solbrave pilots thanks Lasse for a particle resupply. Since the Braves run on Tau Drives, and given that line, that would suggest that Ptolemy has some form of facilities for Tau DrivesGaeaman 788 - The sign of Zeta leads to a dead end 14:33, September 5, 2011 (UTC) :@Gaeman I think the particle supply line was referring to the jamming particles that helped them all escape rather than actual particle supply (Tau Drives rely more on electricity rather than particles per say). Besides, the Solbraves have their own ship. For the moment though, we can confirm that the Ptolemy can recharge Tau Drives because of Raphael but whether they have specific equipment catering to Tau Drives or whether they're recharging them unconventionally (IE taking a wire and plugging it in a big socket old school way) is not known. This is especially the case since we don't know whether the Braves and Raphael actually require startup machines like the Throne Veranus, Ahead, GN-X do or whether they have miniature starups already installed onboard like the Gundam Thrones. If they're like the latter they don't really need complex machines in order to start up their machines and just basic electrical recharging is enough. Essentially, I'm trying to say that its easy to transfer electricity to and from something if its only the electricity. Since we are discussing a policy issue about Ptolemy Faction's Tau Drive usage here, there is a big difference between having "equipments specifically catering to Tau Drives" and "adapting a simple wire just to provide electricity to one". The latter isn't impossible either and a skilled engineer should be able to adapt it with some work and if one assumes that hypothetical scenario it to be true, it shows that the Ptomaios faction can recharge the occasional Tau suit or two without necessarily creating equipment specifically planned to cater to Tau Drives per say. :@bronx: Condenser technology has always been improving after every generation, even after the 3rd Generation (which compression technology was mentioned to improved in the 1/100 00 Raiser manual; specifically the part talking about GN Micro Missiles) so its a given that they improved it again, yet two years ago isn't really far off ago. My point was that Condensers should lag behind Tau Drives in terms of operation time because how short GN Archer and 0 Gundam could last compared to the other Tau suits of that time. As I said earlier, 00 Raiser's improved time in the movie could only be because of the Twin Condenser System which wasn't really described but one could easily speculate that it simply involves multiplying the particles among the two Condensers until the 00 Raiser eats all of them (including the base particles) up. Otherwise, its means they essentially they improved their ordinary Large Condenser time more than six to ten times more in "less" than two years, because the 0.03 second result was also achieved in a Post-S2 test. :A Twin Condenser System is still big step in Condensers technology in general but will likely only apply to suits designed to use a Twin Drive System like 00 Raiser in the first place (much like a Twin Drive System operates on a totally higher exponential level than a normal drive). Given we know that the system was being developed by Sherilyn from 00V Senki 10 and that the movie actually showed a "Twin Drive System" in 00's UI screen I'm willing to believe that its mainly because of the Twin Condenser System rather than a huge leap in their traditional Large GN Condensers. Not that I don't believe the base Large GN Condenser has improved, I just don't believe it has improved that much in the short time that passed between right after S2 and the movie, afterall the Trans-Am Burst is essentially the Twin Drive System gone even more burst so it should be more taxing than even the regular Trans-Am (which 00 Gundam could only do for 0.03 seconds). More vague evidence of a Twin Condenser System would be the actual usage of the Raiser System which back in S2 was used by a second pilot to manually help the syncing of the two Drives even further, its usage here may suggest a "Twin Drive" like mechanism involved. Other than that the Trans-Am Burst was designated as a Twin Drive system ability in one of the S2 Official files IIRC, so I'd say it would be a bit hard to mimic the volumes on anything non Twin related (the way I see it, the Twin Condenser System is to the Twin Drive System like a normal Large GN Condenser is to a GN Drive; allowing the suit to operate at those same levels but for a limited period). -SuperSonicSP 06:50, September 6, 2011 (UTC)